[Greg]

Fred,

The water filters now installed are a pair of whole house filters with elements you choose. I used a pair of charcoal filters on the last coach because they would remove the taste and odor of chlorine I used when I santized the water tank. But if you used something like that to replace the large filter you backflush you could select whatever type element you chose.

I had the Groco Paragon in the sister ship to yours, and now have the Mach 5. They both did a great job of delivering both the flow and pressure. You are correct in that the Mach 5 is quieter, but my only concern about trying to retrofit the coach with that pump is you likely will have to grab the 120 volts from the bay heater outlet which could pose a problem if you wanted to spend time in cold weather. You could run another circuit such as pulling from the entertainment center wiring or even running a complete new line but that is a lot of work.

[Kenneth]

Hi Fred,

When I replaced the water heater on now Tom’s 94 Liberty, I disconnected the big sand filter and sent it to the trash pile. You cannot get any parts and sounds like you already know that. I assume you already have a whole house filter, mine did.

My current Liberty had a Headhunter Jetpaq water pump, old and outdated, 120 volt and even though it works fine, I just replaced it with a new Mach 5. What a diffierence in sound, very quiet. I’m now in the process of installiing a small expansion tank because of the reverse osmosis system. Headhunter suggested the expansion tank because as the RO system works it uses small amounts of water and if the Mach 5 cycles 10 times in a certain period of time, it will shut down thinking the system has a leak and then will need reset.

If you have the Paragon pump, you probably have a Microphor toilet and not Headhunter, so going to the Mach 5 would be overkill in my opinion and expensive. You could always replace it with one of the many Grundfos pumps that are available.

[Paul]

Mine’s definitely the Headhunter. One interesting thing to note about it is the electric flush valve. I looked at the valve a couple of years ago when I was troubleshooting and thought I might have to get a new one. I noted that it looked just like an ordinary lawn/garden sprinkler valve, except extrordinarily more expensive. Upon closer inspection, I saw the label on it, “Lawn Genie”. Apparently, someone before me figured this out years ago! The green color should have tipped me off too.

[Archived]

Fred, our 97 coaches had an accumulator or expansion tank. That plays a huge role in the performance of the pump and water system.

If you have not modified the cut in / cut out pressures for your pump the accumulator tank should have a 20 PSI pressure when the plumbing system is de-pressurized. That tank pressure should be checked periodically because once set that way the pump will only cycle periodically, and the water system flow will be excellent for operation of the headhunter toilet. If you Groco pump hasn’t puked I would leave it until it does. I would suggest a backup water pump however so it doesn’t force you to go without water.

Obviously not yet connected, but it give you an idea of something I would consider more valuable than a new Headhunter pump.

[Paul]

Jon,I don’t think that the Shureflow pump will produce enough flow to flush the Headhunter toilet,I carry a spare Mach 5 pump for that reason as well as a toilet valve,timer,and switch.

[Archived]

Jack,

When I added the back up pump to my 97 coach it couldn’t deliver the flow at the Groco pump pressure, but it did create the pressure which in turn filled the accumulator tank on that coach. The accumulator was directly in line with the toilet and had the same water supply hose as the toilet so if we needed to flush all we had to do was cause the Shurflo to cycle off and the toilet would flush as needed.

That is not the case with the present coach and I am still trying to figure out how I can make room for a second accumulator tank that can be placed in the toilet supply line. I added a second pump which handles all needs except the toilet. It’s on my list of things to do.

[Doug]

Not to highjack this thread, but here’s a Liberty Headhunter
tidbit…

I removed the restrictor and 45 psi regulator from the city water
input and put in a 60 psi regulator. Last month while at TGO for a
couple days I had 60 psi city water pressure, turned the pump off and
the toilet flushed without any problems. You could tell the water jet
was not as strong as when on the Headhunter pump, but it worked fine.
Like Jon, I’m now going to install an expansion tank that should
make the toilet perform the same or close to the same as pump
pressure, as long as I have city water with adequate pressure, 50 psi
or better.

We’ve had this conversation before, but I don’t see any logic in
having to use the pump and tank water when there is city water
with good pressure. As long as you use the pump and tank water
often and keep it fresh, I don’t see a downside.

I had a 2001 CC Magna that had a Headhunter Royal Flush toilet
with 2 Shurflo 12v water pumps and it worked fine. Freddy in the land
of taxes, can you verify that statement?

[Larry & Diane]

This is the beginning. The little Shurflo type pump is a back up in cast the Mach 5 Headhunter pump fails. The problem is the water delivery is inadequate to flush the Headhunter toilet. So for months I had been trying to figure out how to make that happen, I knew from experience with my previous coach if there was an accumulator in line with the flush valve at full system pressure the toilet would flush, but I had no easy place to locate the accumulator.

It was Tom that answered my question about where by thinking outside the box and placing his accumulator in the sink cabinet in the bathroom.

So I set about to do just that. I made some special fittings for the hose joints to go from the accumulator to the inflow to the flush valve.

Working backwards I joined the Mach 5 output and created a inlet coming from the bathroom

The copper assembly takes water from the accumulator at the hose just above the elbow and in a straight line is the inlet hose to the flush valve. Coming up from the bottom is the outlet from the Mach 5 or the supply from the back up pump.

The hard part was trying to route the water line from the accumulator, but I was just able to find room in the pipe and wiring chase next to the toilet.

That’s where the water line from the accumulator goes through the floor into the elbow shown in the previous picture.

The accumulator line gets moved back over the down pipe.

And there it is. You can just see the elbow from the previous picture with the pipe chase side panel back in place. The accumulator tank will be secured and a shelf mounted on the top plate. The toilet flushes beatutifully even with both pumps off as long as the system is at pressure so the small back up pump combined with the accumulator is great back up.

The accumulator is a Shurflo 3400 series which was available from stock http://www.altestore.com/store/ $1180

[Archived]

Nice job,puts my ole blue off the shelf at Home Depot accumulator to shame!

[Archived]

Thanks for including the pictures with your project. Double clamps, reenforced hose, copper elbows, all the right stuff for worry free service.

Nice job…. Jon

[Susan]

Thanks to Tom. If he had not given me the idea for accumulator placement I would still be scratching my head.

I did not want to use elbows, but with the severe space limitations the braided vinyl hose would kink when I made the bends so I reluctantly created the copper fittings. I tried to get barbed hose fittings but they had smaller inside diameters than the copper and one thing I learned is the Headhunter toilet not only needs pressure behind the water flow, it needs as much volume as possible so I had to eliminate kinks that might limit flow.

Now if the Mach 5 quits we will not have to share a toilet seat with 10,000 of our closest friends.

BTW, for those who are contemplating a similar back up the system pressure is 40 PSI cut in, 60 PSI cut out. The 120 VAC Shurflo back up pump was selected for having that pressure range. The braided tubing is rated for 125 PSI and it swells up more than I am comfortable with. It may be fine, but I need to either get confident is it OK, or I need to change it to pipe or tubing or hose that has a greater upper pressure limit.