[Archived]

XL = Rivets

XLII = No Rivets

Any XLII is susceptible to possible panel delamination. Anybody buying an XLII should, at a minimum, have a DMI (Detailed Mechanical Inspection) and and an inspection for body panel delamination done at a Prevost Service Center. Not just a Prevost authorized service center but an actual Prevost Service Center.

There is just too much risk if you don’t have it done.

There is a Prevost Service Center in Dallas.

Just my opinion.

[Archived]

Must be checked by Prevost as stated above, my 01 Liberty had to be done. It has to be inspected at Prevost and then Quebec makes the decision. If older than 10 years and not the original owner, a 40,000 repair is coming your way. Regardless of what you hear about alternative non Prevost repairs, there is only one way to have it done properly.

Buying any Year XLII without this inspection by Prevost could be a major mistake. Take it from people like Jon or myself, we’ve been there, done that and have first hand experience at Jacksonville.

[Michael]

If the coach is an XLII, and the visible vertical strips at the panel joints are not on the coach get the coach inspected.

If there is a delamination problem that has not been addressed with the permanent repair DONE ONLY BY PREVOST the cost to do the repair can easily reach $50,000.

[Archived]

Thanks’ passed this off to my friend

[Bernie]

Nutz!! NUTZ! NUTZ!!! GRRRHHH! Early ones, absolutely!

It irritates us to no end. After owning an almost new 2002 Marathon XLII single slide between November 2002 to October 2004, for 2years, Prevost was gluing that coach back together (stainless panel adhesive failure) continually until we got rid of it

Art, tell your friend, if a selling entity says an XLII has no panels delam issues and as Truk stated has NO patch panel strip, RUN Away from it. Every XLII has or will have stainless sides come loose. EVERY SINGLE STINKING XLII will end up with loose panels. No EXEPTIONS, including brand new X3s. This has obviously struck a raw nerve with US. No Patch Panel, NO Purchase. Period. Unless you can negotiate “Rivet Kit with Paint” price reduction, it’s not worth the brain damage DMRV, and Arizona Coach both have several XLII.s with patch panel. We were lucky enough recently, to find a 1999 shell rivet coach with two slide rooms and a Girard patio electric awning in our budget If an XLII had been cost acceptable, we would have owned a rivet kit wearing XLII

Gee, and while I’m ranting, Never let anyone loose on your roof with a power sprayer, unless you want your roof caulk blown off!

in January 2019, we found an 2010 XLII single slide we were lusting over. It’s panels were loose, the strips below the side windows were falling off as well as the strip right above bay doors. After checking with Mira Loma “rivet kit” install cash cost and no new paint work involvement, We made an offer with self paying panel repair in mind. Selling entity said “delam” was a conspiracy theory and our offer was declined.

Several years ago, I had a chance to speak with Guillaume Charron in Quebec Prevost about Rivet Kits As an after production retrofit, he said if we ordered a new X-3 shells, it could be sent over to the Quebec Service Center and have the No See-um Rivets installed before the shell left to converter

Rant over ‘-)

[Archived]

Does anyone have pictures of a panel delamination or of the panel strips? We are just beginning our search for a 2006-2008 and are grateful for the knowledge offered by this group!
Jeff and Yvonne

[Jim/Chris]

If you are looking for an XLII the strips are obvious. They are vertical strips about 2″ wide that cover the joint between the coach skin panels and are going to run from beneath the windows (the belt below the windows) to the top of the belt above the bay doors. Beneath the strips the ends of the skin panels have been riveted to the chassis structure as well as glued.

Despite Jim’s assertion that every coach without the rivet repair will delaminate that is not completely correct. Some coaches never had skin delamination. But that does not mean the coach should not be tested for delamination.

If anyone selling a coach tries to talk you out of having Prevost test for delamination walk away. Testing involves tapping the panels and listening for a sound that suggests the panel has loosened. Pushing on the panels will be a part of the test because panels correctly bonded will not “give” or “oil can”.

Finally Prevost will pressurize the coach and spray a soapy water solution on the skin perimeters and look for bubbles to indicate the air is escaping from behind panels that have come loose.

At that point you get either a clean bill of health, or you get an estimate of the cost of repairs plus a possible indication ofi if Prevost will provide some of the repair cost.

My coach was one of the last ones repaired at Jacksonville prior to the rivet repair process. It does not have rivets or the strips and I am watching it like a hawk looking for signs of panel delamination. So far after 8 years, nothing has shown to be a failure of the panel adhesive. Do not rule out a coach that does not have the visible strips, but also do not buy one without the strips without a Prevost evaluation.

[Archived]

Jeff, looking at the XLII side curbside you will see a vertical stainless strip about 3 inches wide that sits “proud” over on top of the main panels covering seam, obscuring counter sunk rivets on either side of panel joint. On slide side of bus, you will identify what looks like a stainless edge bordering the slide edge both on slideroom and bus side next to slide opening

physically, you can “tap” with your finger the panel seam edge and one two things can happen

one, you can visually see panel move in and out pushing inward with a finger in comparison to the other panel opposite one youre poking remains stationary

two, audibly while tapping panel at seam, you can hear a tacky thwacking sound while tapping it shows its loose. If you tap seam edge and a sold non moving thunk, it’s tight

[Roscoeapproved]

Passed on info to friend and he is keeping his rivet coach Thanks’

---

Jeff and Lindsay

91 Marathon XL

[Bill]

Here is a picture of my 01 Liberty during the rivet process. Once painted, they blend in great, but at least you can see what the vertical patch looks like.

C’bus is dead on, buyer beware.

[Dave]

OK, Jon

i stand corrected about our total generalization. Only the coaches we have personally inspected( panel tapped with finger) had loose panels both “retail coaches” and owned coaches we randomly see

[Bernie]

While there seemed to be a lot of coaches with delamination, mine included, there were a lot more that never had an issue. I am of the opinion Prevost especially would have wanted to know why that was the case. Prevost stood behind the problem and came up with the rivet fix, which was an expensive but permanent solution.

We rarely hear of the problem so my guess is there are still coaches out there that should be repaired, but most of what is currently in use is OK.

Despite the amount of discussions about delamination there are still buyers that will not verify the coach is OK, there are still sellers who don’t want to talk about it, and no doubt there are coaches still needing repair.

[Dick]

Jim and Chris, if you want to switch buses, maybe we can console you a bit regarding the amount of risk you might be taking. When we switched from Liberty to Royale we:

1) went from no delamination risk to max delamination risk

2) no awning risk to max awning risk

3) no slide risk to max slide risk

4) minimum front axle risk to max independent front axle risk.

Maybe we have the riskiest pre emission model on the planet. Think of this if you balk at pulling the trigger. You may not be taking the most risk or are certainly not alone.

[rafael]

I don’t have a dog in this hunt (we have a 98 XLV shell with rivets), but I have had a question ever since I became aware of and understood the delamination problem. I hope I haven’t asked the question before and now I’m redundant.

Why don’t simply rivet the panels to the underlying framework and turn the XLII’s to “rivet coaches”?

I don’t think that Prevost used bucked rivets on the earlier XLx and XLVs. The rivets on our coach look like stainless steel “pop” rivets (blind rivets is the technical term) … obviously made of high grade stainless steel and installed using tools you might not find at a local hardware store.

We spent three days at Prevost Jacksonville in January of 2015 and an XLII was there getting “the fix”. I sat outside and watched the guy. After about noon on the second day I came to the conclusion “the fix” is a putzy, labor intensive process that is completed by a skilled craftsman. Hence the cost before even thinking about painting.

[Joe]

On the surface Dick you question makes sense, but then I got to remembering my 97 coach.

It made noises as I am sure yours does. Those noises were the coach changing dimensions as parts of it were heated such as by the sun, while other parts such as the side in the shade and the frame weren’t heated as much.

My coach skins alternately were buckled out a little, and at other times drawn tight. Then I remember watching Prevost production and I remember seeing the roof skins being heated prior to installation. That heating likely was to expand the panels so as they cooled they were drawn tight.

I think a Prevost engineer would have to answer your question because I heard at one time a bus that goes from a cold shell starting temperature to a high temperature can expand as much as 1/2″ which suggests there might be more involved than just riveting skins to the chassis.