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Censorship on another site
There is another site on which the owner’s hand picked buddies occasionally take shots at Prevost Community. That’s OK because we do our share of stirring the pot as we did when we had some fun with the sale of the site owner’s bus failing to happen on his own web site.
But there is one area we take very seriously because Prevost Community was shaped by our desire to become a site for the benefit of owners such as Tom and I are. We want free open discussions that sometimes are painful. As long as the discussions are constructive or instructional the benefits of such open discussion far outweigh the associated pain. Censorship of posts critical of an advertiser put Tom and I on the spot because if the post is valuable to our members, and as long as it outlines where the advertiser has failed the customer we have chosen to let the post stand. That posture may impact our pocketbooks, but in the long run we think everyone benefits. The only limits we place on such posts is that they are constructive even if they are critical.
Today on the other site, for which members pay $100 to read and post the following post was made:
A sort time later a second post was made:
Sorry to hear this. Excalibur Coach is a Sponsor on POG and has many satisfied customers that swear by their work. As a business owner I know I can’t hit a home run every time I’m up to bat. The way we resolve our complaints is how we are judged. Hopefully this has a positive resolution.
Both posts were excellent. Both posts were of the nature such that the advertiser was made aware of problems and could have dealt with the original poster, and then the advertiser or the person writing the first post could have done a follow up post.
Instead the thread is gone without a trace. Yes the advertiser no longer has critical remarks about his company on the forum, but the members of the forum no longer have a piece of advice from either of the two members who posted.
I am not writing this thread to encourage our members to pile on our advertisers, but to use the above to illustrate very clearly if you have something to say about an advertiser you are free to post it on this site as long as it is accurate and constructive. Whether the post is critical or praise we all want to have that information shared. We all benefit. But we have expectations regarding critical posts. Be accurate, and make sure whoever the post is about is not being unfairly trashed. If we suspect there is a lack of veracity, or the post is not constructive or instructive we will delete it. Secondly, and this is just common sense, before you make any critical post we fully expect you will have exhausted efforts to work with the person or company you are posting about. Give that company an opportunity to make things right, and then if all else fails let us know. But if the company does make things right be fair and post that as well. What the second post above said is right on target, anyone can screw up, but how it gets resolved is what separates the men from the boys.
Tom doesn’t know of this post so unless he agrees this is my opinion only.
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16 Replies
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Well said Jon, I absolutely concur. Looking at reviews/comments on products or vendors should be no different that those we look at on Amazon or TripAdvisor. Probably disregard the over the top glowing or dreadfully bad ones and look at what the majority are saying. Only way to get a rounded view is to see as many comments/reviews as possible. This is especially important to someone like myself who doesn’t have experience of any of the relevant suppliers so others’ experiences are critical.
1999 XLV X-6872, liberty #440 -
Jon,
Many things make this forum attractive to me. The mechanical expertise of the members, the decades of Prevost experience to draw on, the willingness of members to help not only on the forum but frequently hands on, the discussion of shared experiences, and many many more. One of those many is the ability to share uncensored information about the providers that service our coaches. We spend thousands of dollars for work to on our coaches. I have been fortunate in that the providers I have used in my time as a coach owner have all done quality work. Prevost Fort Worth, Panterra and Luxury Coach all have my recommendation. Members here warned me off of others. Surely open discussion about the positive and negative of the providers we encounter is a value to us all. The other site has members with the same qualities I admire on PC and have been helpful to me. It really boils down to a simple philosophy; PROFIT vs. OWNERS BEST INTEREST
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Well said George & Becky,
It amazes me that one can”t excercise freedom of speech especially when it comes down to something that could be costly and possibly dangerous to us, poor quality service to me can be very dangerous, such as loose bolts broken wires wrong air pressures etc…. we shouldn’t have to even check someones work on our coach… we take our coaches to folks we believe in and pay a premium for their expertise… we deserve to get just that !!
Having said that…we are all human and can very easily make a mistake but the way it is rectified is the answer to good service… we were the victims of horrible service for sometime but got our “wakeup” call just in time before anything really bad happened, however it cost us thousands of $$$$s and taught us a big lesson.
We spent a week at Coachworx and had things rectified and Rick and Ben were just awesome… they went “way” beyond the call of duty for us and our bus was like new !! Thank you Rick and Ben !!So there are really good guys out there just ask around this site and do your homework and all will be well!
Happy and safe travels to all,
Diane -
It’s nothing new at POG. After I was censored there someone invited me to leave if I didn’t like it. I didn’t and I did.
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Glad to hear it was corrected.
My previous post wasn’t really on topic so I deleted it.
Sometimes I get carried away.
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A happy ending and very glad to see the thread was NOT censored, but was removed by the originator.
The originator or the thread had a very happy resolution because all his money was reimbursed. I am glad to see the thread was not deleted due to censorship because we owners need to share information, and the fact the post was made likely caused the company being critcized to resolve it to the Prevost owners complete satisfaction.
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Glad it all worked out for Larry, but the deletion of his post on POG, Inc. certainly would not have been necessary here on PC. We would have allowed the dialog to continue for all to see and the results would not have been kept behind closed doors. It’s important both parties work through the problem and a resolution found that reflects a positive outcome.
Think about it, the few that saw the post on POG, Inc. followed by a deletion of the post would have nothing but bad thoughts about the repair facility whether right or wrong because they never saw the results.
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Exactly Tom and Jon !! We need to be informed.
Good Post !!Diane
1999 XLV X-6872, liberty #440 -
It appears the problem with Excaliber was not resolved.
I recently took my Prevost to Excalibur for service to the galley AC, oil change, lube, replace end of power cord, and transmission service. I had spoke with Marathon Coach and Excalibur regarding the AC, both said it needed a new PCM power control module. When I went into my coach, the mechanic was taking apart the lounge AC. I told him your working in the wrong AC. I was still charged 3 hours of trouble shooting for this mistake. Excalibur then raised up the rear of the coach to service the engine and transmission. The coach was was on a down hill slope. With most of the weight on the front tires they turned the wheels full left and right to get in to the wheel well to put on new mud flaps. One mechanic was walking around with a air gauge. I asked him what pressure he was putting in the tires? He said 90, 100, and 110 in the rear. They then lubed the coach. When it was all completed. The power steering would not work. The mechanic said the fluid was low. I said it wasn’t low when I left my home north of Tampa. He proceeded to add 16 quarts of fluid to the power steering. I found that hard to believe and asked how much fluid the system held? He did not know. They said I was good to good. I departed for home, 5 minutes later the power steering when out. I went back to Excalibur of which was now closed. The next day Excalibur said my power steering pump was out and the 16 quarts of steering fluid had been pumped into the engine oil crankcase.They replaced the power steering pump, drained the engine oil for the second time and I headed for home.
I parked the coach in my garage. I could not get any shore power to the coach. I later found that Excalibur had not tightened the white ring that stops the cord from retracting to far after they had put a new plug on the end of my power cord. Due to this, 2 wires had been pulled loose out of the plug. The next day I got the coach out to give it a bath. At this time I noticed a puddle of transmission fluid on my floor. Looking under the coach I noticed oil dripping from one of the transmission filters. I thought maybe the bolts to the filter cover were not tight. When I checked, 2 of the 6 bolts on the transmission filter cover were stripped. I started checking all the work Excalibur had just completed at this time. I found several grease fittings had not been greased, the tire pressures were all 100 psi on every tire (which is what it was when I brought it in), the transmission was leaking at the filter cover, wires had been pulled loose from the powers cord. I then called Excalibur and spoke with Dough the owner. He said they were the last to touch the coach and he would refund the fee for the transmission fluid change of $750. (Still waiting on that check). I called Detroit/Allison and made a appointment to fix the transmission leak. Estimate for that $15000. I feel Excalibur should pay to repair the transmission, since they stripped the bolts. I feel my power steering went out at there shop because the coach had most of the weight on the front tires and proceeded to to turn the wheels full left and right. I feel they should pay me because I had to repair the power cord due to there neglect to tighten the stop ring. I feel the should only charge for half a chassis lube since that’s all they did. Note: they also charge way more than other service facilities.
Oil change and lube at Excalibur $6500. At Detroit/ Allison Ocala $2500
Transmission Service at Excalibur $7500. At Detroit/AllisonOcala $4500
Power Steering Pump at Excalibur $4500. At Detroit/ Allison Ocala. $2500
Install power steering pump at Excalibur $3000. At Detroit/ Allison. $1000
I have had coaches now for 25 years and the quality of service and workmanship I received at Excalibur Coach is the worst I have ever had. Never again will I do business with Excalibur Coach.
If you use them I strongly recommend you thoroughly check there work and compare prices with other facilities.
The last post on the topic:
Excalibur is way beyond staff problems. If at one service visit you have as many screw ups as I encountered, they have major problems. If they stood behind there work, that would be another thing. But they don’t! I went to them once before and had serval issues with there work. I gave them a second chance, and it was worse than the first visit. Several members of POG have referred me to some shops that stand behind there work. That’s who I will use the next time. When Excalibur strips the threads on my transmission filter bolts, and then puts it back together and Never says a word to me about it. They know they broke it and the mechanic just tried to cover it up. They were the last to drive my coach and due to there neglect they broke my power steering pump, then have the nerve to over charge me for the repair, they are a bunch of crooks.
Larry Sturm
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Post is still on POG>
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Sweet, that’s almost three hours! Maybe he’s taking a nap…
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What I find a shame is that they evidentally do not care about the sharing of information. I believe the mark of a true censorship free forum (aside from unsubstantiated spewing of hateful information) is one where everyone feels free to share information, whether good or bad and without fear of it being deletied even if it concerns one of its advertisers/partners. As Jon and others have so eloquently stated before, we all benefit from the shareing of information. What makes this forum enjoyable is the frequent bantering between members (although it seems as though Jon gets it from all angles…lol
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I’m starting to get confused now. Is the still the first poor customer experience at Excaliber that was discussed here a week or so ago … or is this yet a second situation gone bad?
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Dick, same one…..the first post was removed and now has been re-posted with some additional info.
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Hi,
I’m Larry Sturm that made the post about Excalibur on the POG forum this week. I removed it because I thought Excalibur might stand behind their work and felt their members did not like me talking bad about one of their sponsors. Doug stated he would refund me for the transmission service only ($750). I called Friday and found out they did not send me a check. My post is now back up on POG and this site for all to see!
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