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Radiator removal
How difficult is it to remove and replace a 1989 XL radiator with a 8V92-TA? Is it something an average mechanic can do? Is there a manual on doing this?
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21 Replies
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It is not a job that requires any sophisticated skills, but it is heavy. It has been a long time since I did it and nothing about the removal and replacement stands out except I think the rear hose fitting was a challenge.
Some guys have recently gone through replacement or recoring and should be able to provide some specifics.
I used the opportunity to do a lot of scraping and painting in an area that all of a sudden becomes accessible with the radiator out.
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Thanks Jon
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Jim, while I did not actually participate personally with the removal & recoring of mine 2 yrs ago,I had it done at a small regional Tour Bus company in Joplin ,Mo. The venue owned several Prevosts and their mechanic (believe it or not) was expereincing a lull of work to do.Soo a bargain was struck and while it was being recored,they took the time (as Jon did) to clean up a fair amount of space that is normally either inaccessible or difficult at least.The biggest part of the job was topping off the coolent and bleeding it off, they used my Webasto system to do a lot and spent quite some time in ‘Burping” the bus.It has worked well ever since.
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Jim,
I just completed the swap in my 1991 H3 with an 8V92. Nothing complicated, just time consuming and heavy. I used a local radiator shop for the recore and it cost me $2700 for their part. Prevost wanted $3700 dollars for the radiator. Where are you in Spartanburg? I am just 25 miles north of there and I have a friend with an Eagle bus who lives in that area that could help you with a local mechanic. If you would like you can email me at tomhamrick@yahoo.com.
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Hi Jim, fellow Beaver owner here,
I replaced mine a couple of years ago, because of exterior corrosion. The fins were so fragile, that even the slightest touch sent them crumbling to the ground.
I purchased a core from a place in Chicago, and did the work myself. I used a floor jack to handle the weight. Pretty standard procedure, just nuts and bolts. As mentioned in another post, great time for some cleaning and painting of some otherwise non accessable areas.
Be sure to replace the coolant at the same time, and moniter the SCA levels with some test strips at service time.
I was surprised at the number of tubes that were completely blocked by lime. Definately time for replacement.
On a long hard grade I still could overheat, if I just held the “pedal to the medal.” I.ve learned to limit boost on a long climb to about 10-12 pounds, and get along just fine. Rarely climbs to 200 degrees. A little slower maybe, but I’ve got lots of time.
Hope this helps a little. Contact me if you have any questions.
Dick Egler
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Dick,
Something is just not right. I am certain a lot of others on here with experience with an 8V92 will tell you that under full load, long steep hill conditions a cooling system with a good radiator as yours is will run all day long at no greater than 190 to 195 in 90 degree ambient temps. On the flat, under the same ambient conditions it will run 175 to 185 cycling with the engine thermostat.
Its been a while since we had our 8V92 but we frequently pulled 6 and 7% grades that were 5 or 6 miles long and temperatures would stabilize at 190 or 195. My pyros were at 1100 and I was at maximum turbo boost the specific value I cannot remember. If I recall we were in 4th gear and at max RPM. I had manually shifted it so it would hold in 4th.
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To all that responded, Jon, Rodger, Tom, Dick, as we say
back home MAHALO.After reading your replies, I am still uncertain that the lack of cooling
properly by the radiator is the problem.About a month ago we drove from Columbus, Ohio down to Chattanooga
pulling a 28’ trailer, on the long uphill grade as you first enter Tennessee on
I-75, the engine shut down with the red
light on. After a few minutes the light
went out, and we continued. The temperature
stayed between 200 and 210. On the way
back from Chattanooga, driving at 70, the red light came on again. Stopped in Knoxville
and checked the coolant. It took 3
gallons of 50/50. On the way to
Asheville it climbed up to 210 again.
Stopped in Newport and checked the coolant level and it was still
full. Continuing on I-40 it still ran
over 200 but we were now only going 55 so we made it in to Asheville then on to
Spartanburg. Confirmed that the coolant
was still full the next morning.A few days later we left Spartanburg for Florida, I drove
about 70 without the trailer. This is mostly downhill till you reach I-95
and it overheated several times to the point that it shut down. I learned
that if I only drove 55 that it would stay below 200. At 55 MPH it stayed
below 200 coming back up the grades to Spartanburg.Had WW Williams change both thermostats, (one was broken)
and the water pump. Replaced all the
coolant. On the test drive on I-85 at
65MPH it was fine at first until the transmission started coming up, then the
engine temperature started following the transmission temperature over 200. Granted we had a 100 degree day.My question, is the answer still the radiator, or are there
other things that I should be looking at? The radiator is not crumbling as some
of you have experienced. After the test
drive, the WW Williams mechanic did check the radiator with his laser heat gun. He said there was an 18 degree differential
between the inlet and the outlet and that 30 degree was normal. This is a Heavy Duty radiator and 30 degree
differential could be correct. That was
what got me looking into the radiator. The
fact that speed seems to make more of a difference in the cooling then pulling,
is still puzzling. Is that normal?Tom, thanks for the offer, my nephew who lives in Inman, is
an ASE mechanic and teaches at Spartanburg Community College. Right now he has some time off.Dick, thanks for the update.
Would like to talk “Beaver” with you sometime.Had to come back to Kona Hawaii to check up on the
farm. Should be back in Spartanburg
toward the end of next week. We are staying at the Cunningham RV Campground
near the intersection of I-85 & I-28.Sorry to take so much space.
Hope there isn’t a message limit. -
Jim,
Sorry for addressing you as Dick previously. The temps you are experiencing are not normal and based on your description of how you were driving it 3 gallons low and driving it until shut down the engine may have been damaged.
As to the specific problem it sounds as though you have taken car of the engine with the thermostats and water pump but that the radiator is not doing the job at all. In my experience and based on posts from over the years it appears that unless a 2 stroke engine cooling system has been well maintained over the years with regular coolant changes and testing the radiators are quick to plug. In your case you are subjecting your coach to the maximum challenge and if anything in the radiator is blocked or compromised such as bad fins you are going to have issues. You are pulling a big trailer, likely heavy. You are dirving fast, in hills and high ambient temps. That is a challenge to any cooling system.
If it were my coach I would do two things immediately. First I would make absolutely certain the radiator had full flow, clean tubes, good fins and the fan was not slipping and if equipped the shutters were wide open. The second thing I would do is drive using the temperature gauge as a guide. I sure wouldn’t wait for the red light and DDEC to shut me down.
And slow down. Just because you can go fast, doesn’t mean you can stop. None of my coaches were what I would call good at braking, and the folks in front of you haven’t got a prayer.
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Does your fan work correctly? I didn’t see any reference to that being checked out.
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Jon & Mark
A couple of additional facts. We bought this coach last August in Marion, Ohio. We only had one trip in it, around Thanksgiving to Raleigh and return. No trailer and it ran just fine. We received very few manuals and just a few receipts. So in June before we left on this trip everything was serviced at the Prevost repair and modifcation center there. I am not sure if the coolant was checked as I don’t remember the technician asking me for the key to the coolant door. Of course he may have a key if one type fits all. So when the coolant turned up 3 gallons short I was afraid that something serious was wrong. There was no drips from anywhere and the oil was just fine. So I expect that the system needed burping.
I have looked at the fan and it is not a thermal couple type. 32.5″ diameter metal fan with 8 blades and you can not cause it to slip by trying to rotate the fan when it is stopped. The shroud does have a small amount of the left side, about 17″ by 1.5″ to 2″ of the part that partially covers the fan, broken off. That certainly can effect the efficiency of the fan. I have located a replacement shroud. Will take the radiator out and have Rowland Radiator in Spartanburg check it out. Even if I have to have it recored or get a new one, I would like to know the condition of the current one.
Jon, did you talk to my wife? She thinks that 70 is to fast also. She even reads the signs for me, like slow curve, 45 or 55. Even the speed limit changes except for the 70. Those 18 wheelers must think it is great as I get passed frequently.
Aloha
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Jim,
Your wife is a smart lady. Every one of us could drive at 70 MPH safely as long as we were the only vehicles on the road. But we are not, and most of those we allow to drive on our roads have stopping distances about 1/3 of ours assuming we are driving a coach with perfect brakes.
Our cars at 60 MPH stop on average in about 115 feet. At 70 MPH about 170 feet. When your coach was new it took about 340 feet to stop at 60. It requires well in excess of 450 feet at 70. Add in your trailer to the equation and it is probable your distances increase. From the time you see the tail lights of the car in front of you until you step on the brakes you are likely to travel 80 or more feet so add that to your stopping distance. So by the time a car at 60 has come to a stop you have barely begun to slow your coach.
Despite your best efforts to maintain the football field length between you and the car in front you can count on the fact a car will pass, pull in too close and take away the safe following distance you require. So the bottom line is you can drive at whatever speed you liike, but you and the cars in front of you are at risk at 60 MPH and at 70 it is downright dangerous.
Let the truckers pass. Just because they are driving fast, tailgating, and pulling in too close to your front bumper when they pass doesn’t mean you have to drive like they do. Relax. Enjoy the ride.
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Jim,
If your going to do the radiator work, you probably want to replace the fan if it’s the old metal type. The upgrade fan is fiberglass or plastic, I don’t remember.
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On my previous 8V coach I repaced the fan with a light weight one ftom Prevoist. On my present Series 400 coach I use only pre-mixed CAT certified antifreeze. Aprox. 39 gallons total. I assume CAT mixes deionized water with their anti freeze on a 50 / 50 mix. Chevron developed it as a extended life product. CAT brand is easy to find at their dealers everywhear and major truck parts houses.
Good Luck. -
Harry,
What’s a series 400 Coach? You didn’t think we would let that slide did you! LOL
Glad your posting, we need a metal man here…
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Jon, Tom, anyone else
Does anyone have or know of instructions, a video, etc, for removal of the XL radiator? I have a 91 XL 40 which needs to be removed to recore, rod out or something else. As long as I drive about 60 mph, my temp will stay in the 190-195 range but if I creep up to 65-70 it starts going up to 205-210. I have never had the coach shut down due to over temp because I watch the temps like a hawk but I don’t want to get to that point. Two years ago I flushed the system using the detroit flush and replaced with new detroit 50-50 antifreeze. It was really marginal if that helped any at all. My upper radiator hose also needs to be replaced as it is original and is starting to get spongy, so running it anymore is taking a chance. I could replace it at the same time as the radiator rework.
I can just start taking parts off but that may mean more work and time that could be avoided if someone has the info.
Rob
91 XL 40
Missouri
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