[Archived]

I am eagerly awaiting your answers as I’ve had the same problem ever since purchasing my coach in 2006. My coach came with the Heart inverters which I changed to Prosine and recently changed again to Outback so it shouldn’t be an inverter issue.

I believe there’s some sort of a main switchover switch which isn’t fast enough. Don’t know if it’s normal or if the bugger is worn.

[Archived]

I don’t have the definitive answer but I have noticed some patterns on my coach.

We do have a time delay in the transfer switch. I know the delay is very slight, as in maybe a second, but it is discernable when turning shore power on. I do not know if there is a similar delay in removal of shore power.

I do know my Heart Interface inverters also have a delay. When they are turned “off” and then turned back on there is a few seconds delay before they respond. Again, I do not know if removing shore power causes a delay in inverter switching from battery charger mode to inverter mode. I suspect there is because when the inverter has shore power available it passes through a heavy relay, and if the inverter has no shore power it might have to switch to a separate relay or it first has to verify no shore power before sending inverted output power. I believe all the delays are required to avoid phase issues with power coming from various sources.

What I am getting at is there is likely a short interruption of 120V AC power and the various pieces of electrical devices may have sensitivity to those minor interruptions. We have numerous clocks in our house that are on 120 V AC power and some are unaffected if there is a blip in the power supply, and others have to be reset if the lights dim.

[Davy]

I think is has to do with the device like Jon said, some are affected and others are not. In theory, when you disconnect shore power the inverters should instantly pick it up with no loss in AC, but we know that doesn’t always happen.

Mine is pretty quick, but it never can keep up with the clock on the Bose Radio, while most everything else is not affected.

Don’t know if house batteries could cause the problem John. If you can get to them (it’s tough on a Liberty) and get me the 5 letter code branded in the case, I can tell you the mfg. month and year. Providing they are Lifelines.

[Bob]

If the inverters are se up properly this should not happen. What model inverters do you have and what type of control panels are you using? I think you will find the problem is in the set up.

[Archived]

Good advice from Lee, I forgot to mention I have to “defeat” the search function on my Zantrex RC7 GS remotes.

[Harry]

They are model Freedom 25.

I did check the manual and there is an option for “Idle Sensitivity”. This function is set via DIP switches on the backs of the remote panels. This setting will keep the inverters from suppling power if the only draw is the inherent resistance in the system. This is to save some battery power. I was optimistic, but unfortunately the swiches were set to disable this function.

It seems like this behavior is the norm for Libertys, and the DirecTV DVRs are just particularly sensitive to brief interruptions of power. I am thinking the easy solution is to add a small UPS on the DVR.

[Davy]

I am not really up to speed on the technology of some electrical devices, including inverters and AC powered devices sensitive to interruptions of power.

But a small voice in the back of my head keep screaming at me that the reason we cannot have even the slightest possiblilty of overlap from power sources is because of the phase issue. Shore power, generators and inverters all provide 120 volt power with a frequency of 60 Hz. Unless a device like an inverter is set up to exactly match the phase of the 60 Hz from shore power as it is being disconnected such that it can instantaneously step in as the AC power source it is likely there is going to be an interruption of power between devices.

As John indicates, if he has an uniterruptible power supply connected to those devices that cannot tolerate interruptions he likely solves the problem, but I see no other alternative as our coaches are currently set up.

I believe there are some inverters, that when paired with other similar converters they do match each other’s phase automatically, and may do so with other power sources, but I don’t know that for sure. Maybe one of our converters can step into this topic and educate us.

[Archived]

As far as mine go, no inverters = no charge. Your batteries will eventually go dead without the inverters on. I leave mine on all the time. They are set up as an inverter/charger and will allow 120V to pass right on through when they sense AC power. I say leave them on so your batteries don’t go dead which will cause all kinds of weird things to happen.

[Archived]

Mike

You may have a broken fan that cools the invertor. I am not sure if you have 12 v or 24 v inverters, but you can call inverter service in Nashville they will be able to till you can do. Good luck I had an inverter that had a broken cooling fan, Randy at inverter service shipped me a new fan $24 fix.

[Archived]

Mike,

It is important you do a couple of things. First, make sure your inverters are clean and getting cool air through them. They have to keep cool and depending on how Liberty located your inverters you definitely have an internal fan in each one and you likely have a fan for cooling them where they are located. If they are located in the electric bay for example the bay should have a cooling fan designed to draw in outside air and exhaust the air back outside.

I had a coach that had the inverters under the bed and the inverters were set up with ductwork that carried outside air to each inverter and then exhausted that air. But regardless of how the inverter space is kept cool each inverter will have its own internal fan and that fan is controlled by the inverter to cycle on and off as needed.

In both my inverter equipped coaches I ran the compartment fan(s) 100% of the time, but I also periodically turned them off and loaded my inverters to verify the internal fans were also working. The internal and external fans were all the same type 4″ box fans and I carried a spare.

The other thing you should consider is to learn how to “read” your systems. I presume your Liberty is like mine in the sense that you can look at one of your displays or remotes and see your house battery voltage. You will learn how to look at that and know if the batteries are in bulk charge or if they have gone to float. You will also be able to see when they are not charging at all. If you are not sure take your multi-tester and read the voltage at your batteries or some appropriate place with various conditions such as the engine running, engine off, inverters on, inverters off, inverters in bulk or absorb or in float.

You need to develop some proficiency in doing that because you need to be able to give your displays a quick glance and know in an instant that all is well or something is out of order.

[Fred F.]

Mike,

Liberty hard wires the bay cooling fan, it should be running 24/7. As Jon pointed out, without that cooling fan the internal inverter fans will try to keep things cool, but will be hard to do without any bay fan moving hot air outside. If you have a rerfirgerator/entertainment center in a bay, there will also be a hard wired fan running 24/7 to keep that bay cool. Those hard wired fans on my 01 Liberty were 120v.

Your inverters should always be on.

[David]

thanks guys,

one of my inverters seems to have a problem sue with a fan. That is what I am hearing.

Jon, truk , my fans are running 24/7 with no issue.

Im currently running just the one inverter as I’m plugged in and giving the bad fan one a break. Will get the fan fixed to remedy the issue as soon as we get off the road.

Thanks for the reply and insight!

[CHIP]

3 new Lifeline AGMs, 2 original Heart inverter/chargers, 1 possibly silly question:

When on genset or shore power after being on the road with minimal AC load, the chargers spend a lot of time at high amperage (90-110) recharging the batteries which ought to be pretty well charged by the engine 12V alternator.

Do the Hearts just want more charge than the Leece Neville? Anyone else find this to be the case?

[Archived]

Your engine alternator is not fully charging the batteries, and worse if you are running A/C through the inverters you may actually be discharging the batteries.

At best the alternator is providing a maintenance charge. It is likely in the range of 27 to 27.5 volts, while a complete charge requires about 28.4 or thereabouts. When you have the engine off and the inverters assume the role of chargers they start with bulk, them absorb charges which is in the 28.4 volt range and then go to float.

If the batteries are old or have a defect they are going to pull a lot of charging current, or if they have been deeply discharged. Tom may want to add to this because he is our battery guru.

[Archived]

>Your engine alternator is not fully charging the batteries, and worse if you are >running A/C through the inverters you may actually be discharging the >batteries.

Engine alternator (second unit, 12V, on the fan drive) appears to be charging as per the dash house batteries gauge and per the charging meters on the inverter panels. I’m not running A/C through the inverters only (I don’t think it will do this) – though all AC power from shore or gen runs through the inverters…

>At best the alternator is providing a maintenance charge. It is likely in the >range of 27 to 27.5 volts, while a complete charge requires about 28.4 or >thereabouts. When you have the engine off and the inverters assume the role >of chargers they start with bulk, them absorb charges which is in the 28.4 >volt range and then go to float.

When I pulled in home today, I almost immediately plugged in to shore. Inverter #1 immediately started bulk charging @ 110A and then went down to about 20-30A in 30 mins.

>If the batteries are old or have a defect they are going to pull a lot of >charging current, or if they have been deeply discharged. Tom may want to >add to this because he is our battery guru.

Three new Lifeline 8Ds were fitted 2 months ago, so hopefully they are not bad. I’ve not had occasion to fully discharge them.