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Mileage question
At what point would mileage come in to concern if looking for a bus? Assuming all maintenance was done with records where would you start to be concerned with mileage for an 03/04 vintage.
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11 Replies
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I’m sure others will jump in here. In my opinion I am not really sure that mileage is a huge concern under most usual situations. It is important to remember that these buses are designed for the commercial transportation industry. When most even vintage Prevost RVs seldom see over 300,000+ miles it is unlikely that they will ever see what would be considered excessive many miles.
Both in the classic car and pre-owned RV world several other questions should probably be considered when planning the future service cost of ownership. For example, several years ago I looked at a 1998 Liberty with less than 30,000 miles. This coach had been sitting for nearly 20 years without any service at all. It needed thousands of dollars of suspension, brake and electronic work just to get to the point that the drivetrain could then be evaluated. Yes the was an extreme case. I tried very hard to justify the mileage, however in the long run it was just not a viable option for me.
Just my opinion, but not only are extensive service records important, I also believe that the date of those records is something that has to be considered. Meaning that even if a coach was maintained extensively for the first part of its life then sat for the last several years, this has to be taken into consideration. I would rather buy a coach that just made a successful cross country trip than a garage queen.
Bottom line is every situation will be different. Low mileage can be a great selling point. Just think through the entire process and make thoughtful and educated decisions.
Bill III
PS this did not even address anything regarding the degradation of all of the house systems with a lack of use and service.
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I agree with Bill. We sniffed at a couple of really low mileage coaches before we bought our 1999 Liberty in 2014 with 72,000 miles; they just didn’t work for other reasons and I’m glad. Between talking to the seller and sleuthing by Jeff Rowe, we determined that the coach had NOT been driven much in the last three to five years. We were a little concerned, but it certainly wasn’t a deal killer. No use in 20 years … that would scare me. I’m put some money into through inspection and a 500 mile trip before agreeing to buy it.
As far as high mileage goes … for me it would depend on how I planned on using the coach. If we planned on a few local races and events (having The Milwaukee Mile, Road America, and Oshkosh within an hour and Indianapolis within five hours could keep the mileage down) and a round trip to Florida once a year to sit for four or five months … I don’t think I’d have a problem with 400 or 500 or even 600 thousand miles on a conversion.
But if I had plans for lengthy cross country, trans-Canada, Alaska trips a few times a year along with exploring the warm states in the winter and putting on 15 to 25 miles a year … I might opt for a coach with less than 200 or 150 thousand miles.
Its my understanding that the valves and injectors should be run every 125 to 150 thousand miles. Someone with a higher mileage coach or experience with 8V92s and Series 60’s in trucking might have some comments.
2005 XL Thompson Coach
Rarely tow anything behind us.
Sold: 1993 Liberty that we loved for 12 years. -
Thanks for info. yes I would be far more concerned over an older bus with low miles.
It seems that most of what I am seeing in the 2000-2004 year range are in the 130-200K mile range. Understanding these are commercial grade machines I just wasn’t sure if 150-200K miles in that vintage would be of huge concern understanding there is far more than engine mileage in the equation.
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Brett that range would not concern me at all. Another thing that I learned while looking at and considering pre-owned coaches is ones that are simply used to travel or ones that are actually lived in for extended periods of time. The current coach that I have was bought and almost solely used for Penn State tailgating. 80 miles up, place to hang out in the AC and 80 miles back to the garage. To this day it still has the original appliances and even the original white carpet.
My point is unlike a car, mileage is not always a wear and tear indicator of a particular coach. Look and research each an every coach with an open mind. Mileage is probably the easiest indicator to notice, but will never tell the whole story.
Also welcome to Prevost Community! We will have an all new classified area up soon. Our IT team have been working on it for a few weeks now. I am very excited about it and I hope you will all enjoy it.
Once you make a purchase you will wonder what took you so long:)
Bill III
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As I look for my future Coach, 1999 to 2005 are my targets, (mileage is not an issue) newer than that is more than I want to spend for a part time toy and have view just about every Coach posting I can find on all the sites I have thought that the price I will offer the owner will be based on the following. I trust no seller no matter who or what dealer is selling the Coach. Stuff gets old, is worn out or will break. The buying price is only the beginning. I expect to spend at least 35% of the buying price in upgrading and zeroing out the Coach. I am very hard pressed to purchase a Coach at the asking price knowing I will have to spend lots to get it into a zero position. Tires, are a no brainer, new tires are a must, I know there will be lots of engine work as well as systems updates and that will cost lots of money. Interiors will need to be updated and modernized, some of the interiors I have seen are just really dated. I am not interested in buying a Coach and then spending an additional 35%. I would rather offer 35% off the selling price and spend the money with Jeff knowing I am spending money wisely. Tell me where my thinking is way off base. I am a big boy I can take the arrows. Oh, I have no intention of offending anyone so I apologize in advance for offending anyone or rubbing feathers in the opposite direction. Michael
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There is no standard situation when it comes to buying a Prevost conversion. To assume 35% of the coach cost has to be spent to bring it up to some presumed acceptable condition is as wrong as assuming the amount spent will be 0%.
First it is important to sort out personal wants from restoring the mechanical aspects of the house or chassis. As a seller I had no desire to finance a buyer’s need to install special flooring because he did not like the perfectly good flooring in the coach. If the coach flooring was trash that is one thing, but just because it wasn’t the right color that was the buyers responsibility in my mind.
As to mechanical condition coaches range from poorly maintained coaches with no records or receipts and that have to be assumed as needing everything. At the other end of the spectrum are coaches that have had a documented, progressive maintenance program that have nothing due such as an oil change, tires, coolant change, etc. Again, the buyer who thinks he is going to both find that coach, plus get a seller to sell at 35% below the coach value is going to be disappointed. That buyer is going to watch a lot of coaches sold out from under him.
I have yet to run into a new (as in first time buyer) who even had a clue about the extent of maintenance required, who to best do the work, who to best evaluate the need, and how to determine what was truly needed.
Every used coach purchase is going to be based on a visual inspection, a true systems and mechanical inspection, a detailed review of any and all records, and almost as important as everything else combined a coach that is equipped and laid out to suit the buyers needs for the planned use. In other words any used coach purchase is going to be a true compromise because there are so many moving parts to making a wise and successful purchase it is going to involve as much luck as skill and a plan.
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Very well said Jon!
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So if I am to understand Jon’s point to assume that once you find the Coach and decide that on preliminary review it is the Coach you want to purchase. If you do the detailed inspection from an expert and they find repairs and needs of say $25K do you tell the seller that you want to purchase the Coach for the asking price reduced by $25K to zero the Coach out or have the seller address the inspection list before purchase?
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I purchased a 1998 unit from the estate of the original owner. I received maintenance records from the truck shop of his 600 plus trucking maintenance facility. The bus had 140,000 miles but was garaged for about 18 months due to illness.
The tires were 9 years and great tread, most RV units never wear out the tires prior to time recommended replacement.
The interior was in great shape but dated, wife wanted to replace carpet and valances.
I wanted to insure maintenance was up to date.
She got the interior rework including flooring and valances.
I got the bus into the truck shop that maintained our fleet of trucks and told them to change every fluid and inspect the brakes and new shocks all around.
I took the bus to Prevost for an alignment and they said replace the upper and lower A arms and a couple of other front end components that they described as age related deterioration of the bushings in the components.
I then replaced all brake relay units and air bags with compression fittings.
I replaced the hoses on all the brake and air bags,several of the control units.
My bus now sits level for over a month and the primary and secondary air hold with only a few lbs of drop a week.
I think u have to look for a bus that closely fits your needs and plan on putting some money in it to insure it is up to your quality. Each person has different levels of expectations and you need to treat the seller with respect and make a valued purchase with inspection by a qualified person to avoid surprises.
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The only thing to understand here is that you are dealing with 2 different elements in the purchase of a coach.
The first of which is a human element. What a seller will or will not accept is solely his or her choice. In making any purchase of this type I have always tried to find out the motivation for selling. This may give you an indication of how much room you may have to negotiate. Is the seller buying a property and needs the proceeds of the sale for a down payment? Or is the seller only considering selling if they can get enough to move up with the addition of the additional cash they have on hand? Knowing the motivation of the seller should aid in a successful negotiation.
The second element here is of a mechanical nature. The most educated among us or the most advanced diagnostic tools will never completely eliminate all unforeseen failures. Is it possible that you purchase a coach from an honest seller after having it thoroughly inspected from a reputable facility only to have a transmission issue within 500 miles? It is possible and it does happen. All of us here are purchasing a very high quality product in an effort to avoid as much risk as possible, however a Prevost is still mechanical. We will still have unpredictable and random failures.
I have been in the car business whether collector cars or regular passenger cars all of my life. For nearly 10 years I worked for myself in the wholesale end of the car business. Some months I personally would buy and sell as many as 150 cars. Trust me, I learned very quickly that no one can possibly predict the mechanical limitations in all situations. Education and due diligence can help tremendously, but it will never be a guarantee.
I personally love the search. I look forward to the negotiation. Rather than having a specific set of rules, I recommend being educated, have a plan and then worry about the actual purchase price. You would not have gone this far without thinking that the coach is reasonably or at least close to reasonably priced anyway. Correct? Speaking of price, who truly knows what an exact price should be. I learned a long time ago that no matter how educated someone in a pre-owned sales market can be, the selling price will still always be an undetermined variable. Yes, we do have many highly educated members participating in this forum every day. A few of which make a living buying and selling pre-owned Prevost coaches. Do they know 100% of the time, that they are making the correct judgement on buying or passing on a specific coach? No. Maybe the coach should have been bought for $175,000 or possibly $200,000. Who truly knows with 100% certainty what the right number for the right well serviced coach is? My point is this. Let your emotions play into the final stage of the decision. If you pay 10% more for a coach that you plan to enjoy for the next 10 years, does it really matter in the long run? If you pay 50% more please revert back to step one! lol
Shopping for a coach should be fun. Enjoy it and try to make a few friends along the way:)
Bill III
2005 XL Thompson Coach
Rarely tow anything behind us.
Sold: 1993 Liberty that we loved for 12 years. -
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